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Inspired by @Shudraism to make this thread about my ongoing coffee conversations with an ex-colleague and friend. This guy is hardcore BJP-RSS, father was active member in RSS and this guy went to shakhas for years as a kid
He voted for BJP in 2019 but slowly regrets doing so. We haven't discussed CAA NCR yet since he's been onsite.
This thread is to share as well as ask for advice and thoughts on how to continue
This thread is to share as well as ask for advice and thoughts on how to continue
My observation - I first started making a dent in his thinking by discussing the economy. It is the gateway to doubt in a BJP supporter's mind.
Articles like this were helpful https://www.huffingtonpost.in/entry/consumer-spending-fell-for-first-time-in-4-decades-business-standard-report_in_5dce214fe4b0d2e79f8a1749
Articles like this were helpful https://www.huffingtonpost.in/entry/consumer-spending-fell-for-first-time-in-4-decades-business-standard-report_in_5dce214fe4b0d2e79f8a1749
It helped when I made the impact personal.
This colleague has 2 sons so stuff like "Your sons won't get good jobs, you will struggle for their education how will Ram mandir help then?"
This guy supported demonetization but job data really hits hard because he has kids.
This colleague has 2 sons so stuff like "Your sons won't get good jobs, you will struggle for their education how will Ram mandir help then?"
This guy supported demonetization but job data really hits hard because he has kids.
Stay away from claiming arguments from liberal sources like Raghuram Rajan and the Wire. Use the arguments but not the sources. The mental block against them is too high
State loudly your lack of love for any party else everything gets dismissed as a conspiracy by Congress
State loudly your lack of love for any party else everything gets dismissed as a conspiracy by Congress
Appeal to the person's self identity - for this guy it was his pride in work ethic.
Eg "What did Cong do for so long" - "You're Ops Head for last 3 years and I never saw you blaming the previous guy for some work not done last week. If you can be responsible why can't govt?"
Eg "What did Cong do for so long" - "You're Ops Head for last 3 years and I never saw you blaming the previous guy for some work not done last week. If you can be responsible why can't govt?"
The debate got heated when it came to Kashmiris and 370. I also got too emotional at this point which was a mistake. The indoctrination has been so strong and prolonged - it's literally mindwashing. These orgs have systematically removed any trace of empathy for certain groups
I found neither facts nor appeal to civil liberties worked. Kashmiris have been so dehumanized in RSS minds that the first step is to ignite basic empathy. Showing reports of children in jail and asking him to imagine his son in jail, asking if an 8 yo can ever be a terrorist
One recurring argument is that India needs a strong man to transform the country. Here facts like this help: https://www.livemint.com/Politics/kc1fXtgkGRGU2pvlr29tdJ/Will-a-coalition-govt-in-Elections-2019-harm-Indian-economy.html
Also helps to argue that India needs strong institutions and not strongmen. Eg - if you get wrongly put in jail Modiji won't help you but honest police and good courts can.
Appeal to patriotism doesn't work. This guy considers himself deshbhakt but gives fake HRA receipt for taxes. I realise this is because my loyalty to India is to the democratic state, his is to centuries of history and culture, a cultural identity
Overall I found that facts don't work much. 1. Then the facts start being questioned. 2. It becomes a debate to win and lose, and no one likes to accept they are wrong.
Keeping it conversational & appeal to emotions helps. Igniting basic empathy is the first step
Keeping it conversational & appeal to emotions helps. Igniting basic empathy is the first step
Sending facts a few hours later through a WhatsApp message helps sometimes. With a note such as "Came across this article, what do you think?"
A real challenge is comparing the importance of popular sentiment vs individual rights. Could not make much dent in this belief that "maryada of people should be respected" whether Sabarimala or Ram Mandir
Also a challenge - their belief in "greater good of society" vs individual rights & that some sacrifice is necessary for progress. Eg internet for Kashmiris vs national security
Calling out the hypocrisy that the sacrifice is always made by someone else helps but not fully
Calling out the hypocrisy that the sacrifice is always made by someone else helps but not fully
Looking back I feel some discomfort. As a feminist I dislike arguments such as "What if it was your sister/mother" vs a simple appeal to treat us as human beings. But it seems like it was the former kind of argument that worked here (not by my design)
Perhaps this can be considered a first step towards mental deprogramming and the other arguments be introduced later? I would totally understand the discomfort of Muslims here. Conflicted. Would like to hear from others here
Lastly this guy would never have listened to anything if I wasn't Hindu. All the more reason why we Hindus should have these tough conversations. We need to step up.
Thanks for reading. Would love to hear thoughts POV and your experiences @Shudraism @nuts2406 and anyone else
Thanks for reading. Would love to hear thoughts POV and your experiences @Shudraism @nuts2406 and anyone else
